Old Tractors with New Tools, New Barn & Commercial Kitchen at Four Corners Farm with Trip Shaw: EP30

Today’s episode comes to you from Worthington Massachusetts where we visit with Trip Shaw of Four Corners Farm. He’s been growing over 16 years and produces over 8 acres of mixed vegetables for his newly built farmstand. We start off the episodes in this new farm building which has a front porch, farmstand, wash/pack space, walk-in cooler, and even a commercial kitchen space where value added goods will be made to round out this farm stand with coffee, sandwiches, and other taste goods grown on location. We then talk about his Farmall 140 tractors outfitted with new Tilmor tools, walk through the fields and check on the greenhouses before circling back to the barn. 

Transcript

Trip Shaw (00:09):

Let's see. Yeah, my name is Trip Shaw and this is Four Corners Farm. And we're growing on about eight acres, it's our 16th season. Some of what we grow more of is potatoes, asparagus, lettuce, tomatoes.

Andy Chamberlin (00:31):

I'm your host, Andy Chamberlin and I take you behind the scenes with growers who share their strategy for achieving the triple bottom line of sustainability. These interviews unravel how they're building their business to balance success across people, profits, and our planet. One ask I have for you is if you can leave a comment or write a review. There's a feature enabled right now called fan mail so you can send a message via text to the podcast right from the link in the description. These come through as anonymous so if you want to be known or would like me to reply, let me know who you are in the message. Give it a whirl, it's quick, easy, and free and I'd love to hear from you.

(01:11):

Today's episode comes to you from Worthington, Massachusetts, where we visit with Trip Shaw of Four Corners Farm. He's been growing over 16 years and produces over eight acres of mixed vegetables for his newly built farm stand. We start off the episode in the new farm building, which features a front porch, farm stand, wash pack space, walk-in cooler and even a commercial kitchen space where value-added goods will be made to round out this farm stand, including coffee, sandwiches and other tasty goods grown right here on this location. We talk about his Farmall 140 tractors outfitted with new Tilmor tools, walk through the fields and check on the greenhouses before circling back to the barn. Thanks for listening.

Trip Shaw (02:01):

All right, let's see. My name is Trip Shaw and we're in Worthington, Massachusetts. I guess we're just a diverse vegetable farm. Some of what we grow is potatoes, asparagus, tomatoes, lettuce.

Andy Chamberlin (02:18):

And where do you sell it, is it all retail?

Trip Shaw (02:20):

50-50, wholesale, retail. The River Valley Co-op's down in Northampton and Easthampton, they're probably my better wholesale accounts. Some restaurants, few CSA members. But yeah, the farm stand is kind of what I enjoy more I guess, just because it comes to you.

Andy Chamberlin (02:47):

Right, absolutely.

Trip Shaw (02:47):

I used to go to the farmer's market in Pittsfield, I don't know if you maybe passed through there by there. And then, COVID happened and they stopped it and then I didn't go back to it and they're a lot. I don't know, it's a lot of work.

Andy Chamberlin (03:01):

Yeah.

Trip Shaw (03:02):

So yeah, that's the stand.

Andy Chamberlin (03:05):

It's fresh.

Trip Shaw (03:07):

Yeah, for the time being.

Andy Chamberlin (03:11):

So, you just built this last year, right?

Trip Shaw (03:13):

Yeah, we just more or less finished it in December, the stand part.

Andy Chamberlin (03:21):

Yeah.

Trip Shaw (03:21):

But yeah, just this first year with a cooler I've been using I can ... I've been using just coolers like that just for 15 years now just with ice packs.

Andy Chamberlin (03:32):

Oh, oh, just like yeah, foam coolers.

Trip Shaw (03:34):

Yeah. So, I'd have them up on crates so they'd be this level and you could just, but they worked.

Andy Chamberlin (03:40):

Yeah. Right. You fill them full ice?

Trip Shaw (03:44):

Just like a milk jug.

Andy Chamberlin (03:46):

Okay.

Trip Shaw (03:47):

Yeah.

Andy Chamberlin (03:47):

That's creative. Yeah.

Trip Shaw (03:48):

Just throw that in the freezer and then just have a rotation of them or whatnot.

Andy Chamberlin (03:54):

Yeah.

Trip Shaw (03:55):

Yeah. And this was part of the F. C. Grant.

Andy Chamberlin (03:58):

Nice. How big is that cooler?

Trip Shaw (04:02):

This one's 10 by 14.

Andy Chamberlin (04:04):

Okay.

Trip Shaw (04:06):

Yeah, sorry it's kind of a mess in here. The whole-

Andy Chamberlin (04:11):

No, no, you're in construction.

Trip Shaw (04:12):

Yeah. I mean, I don't even have the final permit signed off on yet.

Andy Chamberlin (04:17):

Yeah.

Trip Shaw (04:19):

So-

Andy Chamberlin (04:19):

You're putting it right to use.

Trip Shaw (04:20):

Yeah.

Andy Chamberlin (04:23):

That's nice, that's a good-sized cooler.

Trip Shaw (04:26):

Yeah.

Andy Chamberlin (04:27):

We just put up an eight by 12 CoolBot.

Trip Shaw (04:30):

Yeah, I remember-

Andy Chamberlin (04:31):

Unit just like that.

Trip Shaw (04:32):

I saw your story there and that's kind of encouraged me to pursue this.

Andy Chamberlin (04:37):

Nice.

Trip Shaw (04:38):

And yeah, seems to work and I haven't brought it down yet below 46.

Andy Chamberlin (04:49):

It shouldn't be a problem, ours held just fine in the heat of summer.

Trip Shaw (04:53):

Nice. Yeah otherwise, I've had this now for a good, whatever, 12 years. I think I probably bought the plans off the, what's it, Michael?

Andy Chamberlin (05:05):

Michael Kavate's plans?

Trip Shaw (05:06):

Yeah.

Andy Chamberlin (05:07):

Yeah, off the greens spinner here.

Trip Shaw (05:08):

Or maybe I found them, I don't know.

Andy Chamberlin (05:10):

Yep.

Trip Shaw (05:10):

But it works good, except I couldn't, you're supposed to have PVC slats.

Andy Chamberlin (05:16):

Yeah.

Trip Shaw (05:16):

So, you can just take it in and out and I couldn't get that to work, so I ended up bolts and it's kind of-

Andy Chamberlin (05:22):

Bolt to the basket and then you put the greens right in here?

Trip Shaw (05:24):

Yeah, and then unbolt if I want to be switching baskets.

Andy Chamberlin (05:28):

Uh-huh.

Trip Shaw (05:29):

But yeah, we have this local grant thing, the Harold Grinspoon, I don't know if you've heard of that.

Andy Chamberlin (05:33):

Nope.

Trip Shaw (05:33):

But we just got this greens spinner from Neversink.

Andy Chamberlin (05:39):

So, this will be your wash pack space?

Trip Shaw (05:41):

Yeah. Yep, the trench drain here.

Andy Chamberlin (05:43):

Yep.

Trip Shaw (05:45):

I thought I was going to get grates right away but they're very expensive I realized. I saw you had something that you were looking at the-

Andy Chamberlin (05:55):

Yeah, the, what's that called? Fibergrate.

Trip Shaw (05:59):

Okay.

Andy Chamberlin (06:00):

It's a fiberglass grating material, that might be a good option for you. I think it's fairly durable, lightweight so it's easy to take it out for cleaning. It's a lot cheaper than a steel grate, I would imagine. Less durable than a steel grate but you're not exactly running forklifts over it all day long either so ...

Trip Shaw (06:18):

Yeah. For now, the plan is just when that's over it, I'll just have this off and it'll just kind of live over it and-

Andy Chamberlin (06:25):

Yeah. When did you get this rinse conveyor, have you used it yet?

Trip Shaw (06:31):

No. December, end of December 'cause it was part of the, I guess the contract. The grant didn't get announced 'til late, I guess. But yeah, radishes, I mean, that could be, I've got a good amount of radishes I should probably get up in wholesale. But I saw some farm today that they started just bulking them, topping them, and so I might just do that 'cause they don't hold well in the field. I put the metal up and I didn't have a great plan I didn't know what I was going to do above the door you can see how it-

Andy Chamberlin (07:19):

Oh, yeah.

Trip Shaw (07:21):

Kind of notched out but I guess not quite enough. It was opening smooth but ...

Andy Chamberlin (07:26):

So, I guess yeah, the door should have been framed in just a little bit more.

Trip Shaw (07:32):

I can just-

Andy Chamberlin (07:32):

Now you know.

Trip Shaw (07:33):

Yes, snip it back, I just have to get to it. Yeah, that was also that Harold Grinspoon grant. That one's been really good, it's $2500 but it makes you really kind of think about, I don't know. The mulch layer wasn't much more than 2500, that wasn't either and both of them have been kind of game-changers.

Andy Chamberlin (08:05):

Yeah, yeah.

Trip Shaw (08:06):

Yeah. So, this is honestly this cleaning stuff, maybe because it was dry last harvest season but I couldn't see wanting your carrots or potatoes cleaner than this thing does. But I know Phoenix was running them through a barrel washer then into that.

Andy Chamberlin (08:28):

Yeah. They're doing bulk bins after bulk bins at a time and it's highly variable too, depending on what kind of soils you have. If people have heavier, stickier soils, then they'll use the barrel washer as a first pass and the rinse conveyor as a final rinse essentially. But yeah, most get away with just a barrel washer.

Trip Shaw (08:49):

Yeah. Soil's heavy last year it was so dry that carrots came out clean.

Andy Chamberlin (08:55):

Oh, wow. Pop-free.

Trip Shaw (09:00):

Yeah.

Andy Chamberlin (09:01):

This is a really nice space, you're going to like this once you get it set up and rocking and rolling.

Trip Shaw (09:07):

Yeah, I feel kind of indebted to you guys, there wasn't many resources and it was all those case studies was invaluable just, I don't know, stuff I guess you, maybe it's, I don't know why it didn't seem more intuitive but ...

Andy Chamberlin (09:27):

Yeah, it's just as helpful to have an example of what other people have done and-

Trip Shaw (09:32):

Yeah.

Andy Chamberlin (09:33):

Then they have a meeting with us and kind of-

Trip Shaw (09:35):

Yeah, just be able to ask questions-

Andy Chamberlin (09:36):

Fit it up and see how it sizes up to your farm. I really like the metal in here, that's maintenance-free. Metal walls and concrete floors and you'll be set up for your career.

Trip Shaw (09:49):

Yeah, the metal was nice. We were actually, this is going to be the kitchen.

Andy Chamberlin (09:53):

Okay. No, I like the door.

Trip Shaw (09:57):

Yeah.

Andy Chamberlin (09:58):

Sliding vinyl door.

Trip Shaw (10:00):

It was like $80 from Home Depot, which is-

Andy Chamberlin (10:03):

Priced right.

Trip Shaw (10:04):

Relatively cheap.

Andy Chamberlin (10:05):

Yeah.

Trip Shaw (10:05):

Considering we were looking at, I kind of looked at legit restaurant doors that were like 700 bucks.

Andy Chamberlin (10:11):

Of course, yeah.

Trip Shaw (10:13):

And what mainly got me thinking of these instead of I was going to just do a sliding one like I did for the farm stand, but for the door up there, I got a water spigot coming off the wall so it went and worked for that. And then, I was just online and somehow these popped up.

Andy Chamberlin (10:32):

It looks perfect to me, yeah.

Trip Shaw (10:34):

As long as the Health Department is okay with it. I mean, it seals I think is ...

Andy Chamberlin (10:40):

Yeah.

Trip Shaw (10:41):

Unless you want a full on human door ...

Andy Chamberlin (10:43):

Right.

Trip Shaw (10:43):

Then I think it's-

Andy Chamberlin (10:44):

I'd say that seals pretty darn good.

Trip Shaw (10:47):

A screen door would maybe be my next try if they have a problem with that. Yeah, this is a Trusscore material.

Andy Chamberlin (10:54):

Oh, yeah. Wow.

Trip Shaw (10:56):

Initially I was like, "Oh, we'll do this in the wash pack," and then I priced it and man, yeah, it was a lot. And they also they made one that I was looking at like a RibCore or something it's called, but that seemed tedious too. And then, I talked to another one of your case studies, was that Footprint Farm?

Andy Chamberlin (11:18):

Yeah. Taylor?

Trip Shaw (11:20):

Yeah. Yeah, she encouraged the metal 'cause from her picture, I couldn't tell if she had the RibCore or if it was metal.

Andy Chamberlin (11:29):

Yeah, she's got metal. Are these lights wired up?

Trip Shaw (11:33):

Yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah.

Andy Chamberlin (11:35):

Nice. That looks great. This is an awesome space. So, you said this is the kitchen area, so what are you going to do in here?

Trip Shaw (11:44):

Hopefully turn as much stuff from the field into to-go stuff or maybe eventually some value-added items.

Andy Chamberlin (11:55):

To-go item so like pre-made salad sort of stuff?

Trip Shaw (12:00):

Yeah. Yeah, maybe that'd be some of the first stuff, pre-made salads, maybe self-serve coffee, but some stuff there are less labor-intensive.

Andy Chamberlin (12:09):

Uh-huh. Well, you only have three things in your farm store right now and you've had car after car show up, so I think you're in a good spot.

Trip Shaw (12:19):

I mean, every year it gets busier. I mean, you drove what from Route nine I think?

Andy Chamberlin (12:26):

I don't know.

Trip Shaw (12:27):

Of 143.

Andy Chamberlin (12:28):

Yes.

Trip Shaw (12:28):

So, you probably saw we're somewhat isolated.

Andy Chamberlin (12:31):

Yeah.

Trip Shaw (12:32):

It's like 30 minutes to a grocery store, 20 minutes to a gas station.

Andy Chamberlin (12:38):

Is that an oven?

Trip Shaw (12:39):

Yep.

Andy Chamberlin (12:41):

Nice.

Trip Shaw (12:42):

Yeah, so bread and stuff. My wife is planning she's going to do all the baking.

Andy Chamberlin (12:51):

Okay, yeah.

Trip Shaw (12:55):

And it kind of just worked since just to combine all this stuff in one building.

Andy Chamberlin (13:02):

Yeah.

Trip Shaw (13:04):

I would never take a chance on this stuff standalone, you know what I mean? But it works with the farm, I guess.

Andy Chamberlin (13:10):

Yeah. I really like the windows into the farm stand area too.

Trip Shaw (13:16):

Yeah. These I got off a guy Allen in New Hampshire, Seabrook.

Andy Chamberlin (13:22):

Okay.

Trip Shaw (13:24):

I forget, Strafford Windows. It's surprisingly hard to find people that make, they're like barn sash windows. I just copied the design from my parents' barn so it's kind of, they just rest on the wood.

Andy Chamberlin (13:40):

Uh-huh.

Trip Shaw (13:40):

I painted them recently so that's, I'll get them going smoother but ...

Andy Chamberlin (13:46):

Yeah, it'll take a little bit of working but ...

Trip Shaw (13:47):

But otherwise, I mean ...

Andy Chamberlin (13:47):

Or just having glass between here is great.

Trip Shaw (13:50):

We looked at-

Andy Chamberlin (13:51):

Yeah, I'm not leaving-

Trip Shaw (13:51):

Marvin's or whatever and you can't get that much glass for, it's going to be twice as much as this was for half as much glass or something opening.

Andy Chamberlin (14:03):

How big of an opening is this?

Trip Shaw (14:10):

10, no, 12. I'd say 12 by eight maybe or something.

Andy Chamberlin (14:18):

Yeah, probably.

Trip Shaw (14:19):

I know these are full 10 pieces.

Andy Chamberlin (14:22):

It's big yeah, big window.

Trip Shaw (14:24):

Yeah. I don't quite know what inspired having it open like that. I kind of liked the idea I thought more there was going to be like, you're going to be able to make stuff and just put it out.

Andy Chamberlin (14:37):

Oh, more like cafeteria style but ...

Trip Shaw (14:39):

Yeah, but with a shelf or something, I don't know.

Andy Chamberlin (14:42):

Yeah. Well, it gives you the option too if you want to. Yeah, you could easily pass stuff through or close it up and keep it like an observation area.

Trip Shaw (14:49):

Yeah.

Andy Chamberlin (14:50):

So people can watch the bakery and the process-

Trip Shaw (14:52):

Removes privacy but no, yeah, I think also yeah, it's nice they come in, they'd be like, "Oh yeah, it's getting made right there."

Andy Chamberlin (14:58):

Lets a lot of light in too from that open porch area into the kitchen all the way to the back.

Trip Shaw (15:04):

Yeah. And it might get hot in here so maybe some breeze on ...

Andy Chamberlin (15:09):

Yeah, maybe.

Trip Shaw (15:11):

But yeah, we'll see. It's all new. Yeah, I just filled out the application for the inspection. My only question mark is the floor. It takes a mop but you can see even this, they poured this three slabs at this and that separate and this, see it's more polished?

Andy Chamberlin (15:32):

Just a little bit, yep.

Trip Shaw (15:33):

Yeah, as it turns out. So yeah, I don't know, that's my only question mark. Otherwise, I think we have our bases covered. The three-bay, the mop and the handwash. I know Vermont's got all different stuff.

Andy Chamberlin (15:48):

Yeah, every state is different with their-

Trip Shaw (15:51):

And then Maine, I mean Phoenix City, their town's not incorporated so there's no permits.

Andy Chamberlin (15:58):

Yeah, kitchen spaces is different than wash pack spaces and stuff like that but yeah, if they give you a hard time if the floor's too rough. It's not that big of an area to put an epoxy flooring down and it's-

Trip Shaw (16:09):

Like a two-part one or is it worth it, the two-part or?

Andy Chamberlin (16:13):

The epoxy floor's really nice we have it in our shop and it makes cleanup a breeze from oils and whatnot and be easy to mop too. So, especially with the fresh concrete it'll stick really well.

Trip Shaw (16:25):

All right.

Andy Chamberlin (16:26):

So, you won't have problems with it peeling up. If you try to put it on an old slab, oftentimes they'll actually come through with a grinder and surface the concrete to make it rough to give the epoxy something to stick to. So, that's an option if they say, "Yeah."

Trip Shaw (16:43):

With the stuff you used two parts you had to mix it?

Andy Chamberlin (16:46):

We had a company do it so I don't even know.

Trip Shaw (16:48):

Because they have, I saw some stuff it's like a one part, but I don't know if it's as good or ...

Andy Chamberlin (16:54):

Right. You'll want a heavy duty more of epoxy than a paint.

Trip Shaw (16:58):

Okay.

Andy Chamberlin (16:59):

Because it'll be really hard, durable.

Trip Shaw (17:05):

We could look at some of the field stuff, I guess.

Andy Chamberlin (17:07):

Yep, absolutely.

Trip Shaw (17:08):

I don't know how much time you have, I shouldn't-

Andy Chamberlin (17:09):

No, I've got all afternoon.

Trip Shaw (17:13):

Yeah, there's one of the 140s, these are the backbone of the operation pretty much-

Andy Chamberlin (17:18):

Daily driver, huh?

Trip Shaw (17:20):

It takes a lot to keep them going though.

Andy Chamberlin (17:24):

You like it?

Trip Shaw (17:25):

Oh, yeah.

Andy Chamberlin (17:25):

It seems like a good-sized tractor.

Trip Shaw (17:29):

Yeah, the Tilmor has been a game-changer, I was just thinking that the other day. Because I only got into the Tilmor stuff a few years ago and I don't know, before that it was like the, have you ever used any of these?

Andy Chamberlin (17:45):

No.

Trip Shaw (17:45):

Just like the old, I don't know, you're pretty limited to one row. At least the setup I had it was pretty primitive, but now with this toolbar, like a two-inch toolbar, I can put all sorts of stuff on it. And then yeah, I did the three-point hitch conversion so that opens up more possibilities.

Andy Chamberlin (18:05):

Yep. So, these tractors didn't have a three-point hitch?

Trip Shaw (18:08):

Correct, yeah.

Andy Chamberlin (18:09):

Originally? Yeah, that looks like a wise upgrade.

Trip Shaw (18:12):

Yeah, I love them. They do, I just love the belly-mount.

Andy Chamberlin (18:17):

Yeah, good visibility.

Trip Shaw (18:21):

Yeah, I'm slowly learning. I have a friend who's a wizard and he helps me but yeah, it doesn't take a lot of mind to keep it going, it's just kind of knowing. On the other one we were struggling. He gave me some stuff to do like rebuild the carb and whatnot, and then it turned out to be the points. But we put in new points and then we had less spark and it turned out the brand new points had a little bit of corrosion on them.

Andy Chamberlin (18:54):

Oh.

Trip Shaw (18:56):

And yeah he's like, "Oh, just sand that down," and stuff like that is ... So, everything you do is like three-point hitch you're cultivating or?

Andy Chamberlin (19:05):

Yeah, I'm just getting into cultivating right now. I have a couple, I got some spider gangs last summer that I tried with some sweetcorn, which worked all right.

Trip Shaw (19:18):

Nice.

Andy Chamberlin (19:19):

So, I'm new to cultivation.

Trip Shaw (19:22):

All right.

Andy Chamberlin (19:24):

But we lost a bunch of vegetable crops because my between plastic rows became unmanageable. Out there in July with a weed whacker is not good weed management.

Trip Shaw (19:38):

For between plastics I admittedly got the edge of the plastic finger weeders, but I don't know if it's fully necessary. I like just discs, I can mostly get by with discs and spiders to kind of throw dirt on and then kind of take dirt away. And then, basically just hitting the footpaths is most of it with the shanks on the back or whatever. I got garlic that I can kind of show you how I lay that out for cultivating with those.

Andy Chamberlin (20:12):

Sure.

Trip Shaw (20:12):

That's kind of like the only thing that's growing right now. Yeah, you can check out-

Andy Chamberlin (20:18):

You got a really nice site here.

Trip Shaw (20:21):

Yeah, it is. I lucked out, it has the APR on it.

Andy Chamberlin (20:26):

Okay.

Trip Shaw (20:26):

So, you can't. Luckily, our language in the restriction allowed for a farm stand. Some don't allow for any structures, I guess.

Andy Chamberlin (20:36):

Yeah, that's good.

Trip Shaw (20:37):

But yeah, this is the other 140. And this is like a, I guess a raised, is yours a raised bed layer?

Andy Chamberlin (20:45):

Yeah. You've got the Tilmor raised bed layer plastic, raised bed former plastic mulch layer with drip tape.

Trip Shaw (20:52):

Yeah, except that I don't really run drip.

Andy Chamberlin (20:53):

No?

Trip Shaw (20:54):

Just because we just got town water over there and I don't know. The one year I did finally put drip down a couple years ago, it didn't stop raining.

Andy Chamberlin (21:03):

Yeah. I've laid drip the last two years and have not hitched it up at all so it's like, come on. But I know that dry year is coming.

Trip Shaw (21:13):

It's like insurance.

Andy Chamberlin (21:14):

Yeah, it is. Yep.

Trip Shaw (21:16):

But no, so yeah, the front's got the two discs in this to throw the soil.

Andy Chamberlin (21:23):

Okay. Yep.

Trip Shaw (21:24):

At least for mine. I don't know if yours, you got to throw it or your backend does it all?

Andy Chamberlin (21:28):

Yeah, the bed former gathers it all.

Trip Shaw (21:32):

But if I get my soil real nice I'm able to just do it one pass, just lay the plastic instead of shaping the bed, then coming back and throwing plastic on it.

Andy Chamberlin (21:40):

Yeah.

Trip Shaw (21:44):

It all just works with my kind of row spacing that I already got with the Tilmor so ...

Andy Chamberlin (21:52):

No, I like that you're set up appropriately as far as you're utilizing the belly-mount of the tractor to lay plastic, which makes sense.

Trip Shaw (22:06):

That's my tillage tractor, it's like about 43 horsepower.

Andy Chamberlin (22:11):

Yeah.

Trip Shaw (22:12):

It'd be sweet to have a big one, but it does the ... But yeah, that Perfecta has been a game-changer.

Andy Chamberlin (22:21):

Is that what you use for primary tillage?

Trip Shaw (22:23):

Yeah, that's basically as long as I can get at things like the rye. You can see the right up there I didn't hit yet.

Andy Chamberlin (22:30):

Yeah.

Trip Shaw (22:31):

If I can get at it before much before that, it won't get bound up. But yeah, I've never had to plow.

Andy Chamberlin (22:41):

For good or bad, you don't have one?

Trip Shaw (22:42):

Yeah, I don't know.

Andy Chamberlin (22:44):

Like I said, as long as you get the rye before it gets too-

Trip Shaw (22:46):

I don't know if I've ever done things properly but I just do what works for me and what I have.

Andy Chamberlin (22:53):

No, I've seen seen pictures of a green fender and I almost messaged you. I'm like, "What tractor is that green fender?"

Trip Shaw (23:00):

It's an 86. Yeah, I've had it since for quite a while and John Deere 1250. I just swapped the oils on it basically and she's been pretty good to me.

Andy Chamberlin (23:09):

Good. It got a grapple bucket on there, forks.

Trip Shaw (23:12):

Yeah. This was a pain but it's a learning process is the ... Man, I spent all last summer, we just put this new switch on, me and my friend Chris, I spent all last summer thinking it was a hydraulic issue 'cause I couldn't get my tilt to work and it was a switch that went, and this company still exists in like Jersey, CPI switches. It was from the '80s and they're still, so it's like a really hard switch to find that three-wire switch I guess.

Andy Chamberlin (23:42):

And that's what controls the-

Trip Shaw (23:44):

Yeah, it was just the electrical issue.

Andy Chamberlin (23:45):

Okay.

Trip Shaw (23:46):

For my tilt and my grapple. It switches between the cylinders I guess for to lift to raise that.

Andy Chamberlin (23:52):

Okay.

Trip Shaw (23:53):

Yeah, I guess we better keep moving because of the ... Now the weather it said prepare to take shelter.

Andy Chamberlin (23:58):

Oh, really?

Trip Shaw (23:59):

Yeah. That's what I was using those Oliver Disks that I kind of borrowed from a friend.

Andy Chamberlin (24:06):

Yeah.

Trip Shaw (24:09):

I still actually use them if I got to use them on the plastic 'cause that's bio mulch and if the rye gets tall or the weeds are tall, I got to use them because that Perfecta just totally gets clogged and you're just dragging stuff. This patch I'm planting on winter squash just because it's relatively far from where I had it.

Andy Chamberlin (24:31):

How many acres do you have in production?

Trip Shaw (24:33):

I think eight.

Andy Chamberlin (24:34):

Wow.

Trip Shaw (24:34):

Or eight's tilled in a cover crop or cash crop it.

Andy Chamberlin (24:40):

No, that's quite a bit. And how big's your crew?

Trip Shaw (24:45):

Oh, I'm kind of working on that.

Andy Chamberlin (24:53):

So, what's it been?

Trip Shaw (24:55):

Because then my wife she was doing all the labor with me.

Andy Chamberlin (24:58):

Yeah.

Trip Shaw (24:59):

She was working at the post office and then now with the babies she's ... So, then last year I had hired a couple guys that were just like, "Hey, you need help?" And yeah, I don't know. Labor has its, I guess challenges too but at least I kind of got the idea that yeah, I'm able to pay people. But it's a whole new thing. I got to think of it more as certain jobs get, I don't know. Like today, I called up my friend, "Hey, you want to come help plant onions?" And just pay him some money. We just planted these potatoes and my buddy Chris who's the mechanic, he just hopped on the planting for, it took us two hours. You give him 40 bucks and I don't know, I've been trying to just more I guess tools or whatever for the tractor to-

Andy Chamberlin (25:57):

To keep higher labor at a minimum?

Trip Shaw (25:58):

I guess so, yeah.

Andy Chamberlin (25:59):

Yeah.

Trip Shaw (25:59):

Or even that green services, stuff like that, it's like they say it's like having four people working for you.

Andy Chamberlin (26:04):

Yeah.

Trip Shaw (26:11):

I went through this the other day and the three-point hitch on the one that I showed you up there doesn't have this stabilizer in the back so my rear things were drifting so I took some out here and there but lost a few. But yeah, this is so far no hand weeding. And last year I was able to do the crop without getting off the tractor just by finger weeders. Eventually start off with, I don't know, whatever smaller stuff and then work up to the more aggressive cultivation I guess.

Andy Chamberlin (26:50):

That's cool.

Trip Shaw (26:51):

This year I don't know. The first thing I went through is, I forget subsoilers 'cause after the winter the ground was, you know how it gets, it's like concrete.

Andy Chamberlin (27:02):

Yeah, it can get hard. Yeah.

Trip Shaw (27:04):

These are I plant carrots and beets in these beds. Mostly just because I had this much, what's the word? Budgeted for garlic but I didn't end up needing all the space, so it laid bare this winter I didn't get rye on it, so it made it easier to get a nice seed-bed.

Andy Chamberlin (27:27):

Early.

Trip Shaw (27:27):

Yeah. But I'm going to try to torch. I got a flame weeder. It's a good idea, it looks like the beets are probably trying to come up with the carrots. I don't know, I've had luck sometimes with an early carrot seeding where you just get the carrot up and not that amount of weeds.

Andy Chamberlin (27:46):

Yeah.

Trip Shaw (27:48):

We'll see.

Andy Chamberlin (27:49):

What'd you seed this with?

Trip Shaw (27:51):

The yang or the, how do you say it?

Andy Chamberlin (27:52):

Yang seed or Jang seeder.

Trip Shaw (27:54):

Yeah. Yeah, until again a couple years ago it was either EarthWay and I got the Yang and then yeah, just the push. And then, I got the Yang that goes on the two-inch toolbar and then I got two of them and I don't really ... I could do three rows in here but for cultivating two is already sweet for me 'cause before the Tilmor stuff it was like I said, just one row. So, it took up a lot of space like a single row of carrots every four feet, right?

Andy Chamberlin (28:25):

Yeah.

Trip Shaw (28:26):

Yeah, that's not a great use of space. But these, I mean when the carrot tops are ripping, it looks filled out enough to me. Or lettuce I do two rows, everything, just the two rows and it to me pushes out just fine.

Andy Chamberlin (28:41):

Yeah.

Trip Shaw (28:42):

If you want to look at the hoop house, quickly some greens growing, not much. But yeah, the garlic I'm excited. I'm hoping the kitchen could be inspected before the scapes are done so we could maybe do something like a scape pesto.

Andy Chamberlin (28:57):

Oh, yeah.

Trip Shaw (28:58):

There's strawberries, last year strawberries, this was the first year I tried them on plastic. This is like the permanent plastic or whatever, and I did the double row. And then this is the bio mulch and I did the matted row.

Andy Chamberlin (29:11):

You got a little on-farm experiment going on.

Trip Shaw (29:15):

And they look pretty rough. But last year it was funny 'cause I had some over there that were bare soiled matted row and they were pretty covered in weeds and clover and stuff and they produced wicked good.

Andy Chamberlin (29:29):

Did you cover these over the winter?

Trip Shaw (29:31):

No.

Andy Chamberlin (29:32):

No? Okay. So, this is just like this. Did you have a pretty good snow cover or no?

Trip Shaw (29:36):

No, not this year. I was afraid, actually I was mostly afraid for my garlic, I thought all the freezes and thaws. I mean, we had a lot of single digits. The winter before we only had a few days in the single digits and in the last winter it was a lot. Now, this is my newer experience planting.

Andy Chamberlin (29:55):

Oh.

Trip Shaw (29:56):

A few rows of purple and then the green. I haven't been over here I didn't realize it was already ...

Andy Chamberlin (30:03):

Here it comes. Yeah.

Trip Shaw (30:04):

I guess so. Yeah, you're welcome to eat some. I can tell all that I grow of it but it takes up so much space, so I don't know how worth expanding this or not.

Andy Chamberlin (30:21):

Well, it's a perennial so it'll keep coming.

Trip Shaw (30:24):

Like this bed-

Andy Chamberlin (30:25):

I don't know if I've ever eaten asparagus raw.

Trip Shaw (30:26):

Oh, really?

Andy Chamberlin (30:27):

It tastes like peas.

Trip Shaw (30:29):

I can see that.

Andy Chamberlin (30:30):

It's good.

Trip Shaw (30:30):

Yeah, it's juicy.

Andy Chamberlin (30:33):

How do you manage the weeds in that plot?

Trip Shaw (30:38):

I burn it off in the spring and then just go with my tiller as shallow as I can, pretty good. And then, some years that'll be it until I'm done picking it and then I till it again. And then, once it comes up, till it. Or yeah, if the weeds get out of control what I should do is till it and then you set it back a few days. But this is the only tunnel with anything I'm picking from right now. The lettuce, for example, you could take this much to get, I don't know, 20 half-pound bags and you can get 100 bucks. But for the asparagus you could be bent over every row and maybe get 20 bunches from there and it's way more space. But I guess it's the variety. But yeah, I lost those three covers this winter, so this was the only one that I was able to plant in March.

Andy Chamberlin (31:39):

Well, it looks good with the Jang too?

Trip Shaw (31:43):

Yeah.

Andy Chamberlin (31:43):

Yeah.

Trip Shaw (31:44):

Yeah, until a few years ago I was just coming in with a rototiller, either BCS or tractor. These tunnels I built the end walls in mind with just going right in with the tractor as close to the side as I can so I didn't have to maneuver. But I don't know, I felt like, I don't know, I ended up, now I'm doing the fricking broadfork and permanent beds and it just seems better, I don't know it's ... I don't know If I was getting a tiller pan, I'm sure if I got the chisel plow I could do it all mechanically and get the same effect. But also how you're going to get, at least where these are I can't get a tractor in here in March unless I keep it plowed all year. And so, it's nice not relying on. And part of my operation not relying on the combustion engine, I guess.

Andy Chamberlin (32:44):

Right. What brand are these tunnels?

Trip Shaw (32:47):

Well, I got them from Nolt's.

Andy Chamberlin (32:48):

Okay. Yeah, Nolt's tunnels.

Trip Shaw (32:53):

Yeah, Marcus held my hand putting all these up, I asked so many questions. But then that storm took him out. You follow that guy Deep Roots Farm? He's in New York.

Andy Chamberlin (33:06):

No.

Trip Shaw (33:07):

Deep Roots. I kind of got this idea from him. I said, "Screw the door," and I just ... Like this one the door blew off so I'm adding those verticals and I'm just, like that one I just covered. And then he said, "If you want to get in there with a tractor, just unwiggle wire your, I just framed the opening smaller.

Andy Chamberlin (33:30):

Right 'cause realistically, you're only in there once or twice.

Trip Shaw (33:31):

Dumping manure now, yeah.

Andy Chamberlin (33:33):

Yeah. So, you pull it off for that week or two in the spring when you're prepping and then button it up the rest of the year. That's not a bad idea

Trip Shaw (33:40):

Just to not deal with doors at all.

Andy Chamberlin (33:43):

Yeah.

Trip Shaw (33:44):

I got these two tunnels first and those are my first set of wood doors. But yeah, that one's spinach and this one's nothing because it's not-

Andy Chamberlin (33:55):

It's a sandbox. Yeah.

Trip Shaw (33:57):

May 15th, it's got to be tomatoes that's when I do my tomatoes up here. Trial and error with having the sides planted and then I'll plant the tomatoes down the ... Carrots I was trying it with because I thought they were companions but I feel like lots of times the carrots were too big by the time I put my tomatoes and they kind of hampered.

Andy Chamberlin (34:22):

How do you like the roller hooks for the tomatoes?

Trip Shaw (34:25):

Oh, no, I like them. It just, maybe because I can't quite, you may have just enough reach to get them.

Andy Chamberlin (34:35):

No, I'm on a six-foot stepladder.

Trip Shaw (34:37):

Okay. So, that's the only-

Andy Chamberlin (34:40):

Right now we don't use anything like that, we just use a pipe on the top and a pipe on the bottom and tie a string in between. We can't lower and lean with our existing system. So, I've been thinking about upgrading and just hearing what people like. Can you trip these?

Trip Shaw (34:56):

Do you want one?

Andy Chamberlin (34:57):

From the ground?

Trip Shaw (34:58):

I tried getting some reacher grabbers and the ones I got weren't enough to ...

Andy Chamberlin (35:03):

So, you need to pinch them?

Trip Shaw (35:04):

You can take one if you want. Yeah, but if you got a reacher grabber you could probably ... So, right now what I do is I just get the reacher grabber, get it. I try to-

Andy Chamberlin (35:17):

Okay, so you pinch it.

Trip Shaw (35:18):

Yep.

Andy Chamberlin (35:18):

And that's how it releases. Okay.

Trip Shaw (35:19):

If I have it set up right, yeah. And then, it'll catch there.

Andy Chamberlin (35:25):

Right 'cause that would be the trick, so you could just do it without getting up there.

Trip Shaw (35:29):

Right, yeah.

Andy Chamberlin (35:31):

Versus the tomahooks, I think they're called where it's just wrapped and have to pick it up and flip it.

Trip Shaw (35:39):

Then there's that clipper system but that's wicked expensive, I don't quite understand it either.

Andy Chamberlin (35:44):

Yeah, where you can just, it's a drop wire, which comes down to shoulder height. I just watched a video on it the other day, and then it's got two clips that you basically leapfrog. So, every week instead of adding clips or lowering it down, you can just leapfrog the clips and slide the plant down that heavy duty wire that it's resting on. Looks pretty slick, I haven't seen it a whole lot to-

Trip Shaw (36:10):

Have you priced them?

Andy Chamberlin (36:12):

No.

Trip Shaw (36:13):

They're like, I don't know how, but they're taking a lot.

Andy Chamberlin (36:15):

I thought it was like-

Trip Shaw (36:17):

Three or four bucks a unit or something.

Andy Chamberlin (36:20):

Yeah, when you add it up times several 100 plants in the greenhouse it's not cheap, but I think they would last a long time too.

Trip Shaw (36:27):

Yeah.

Andy Chamberlin (36:27):

But labor isn't cheap either so I always like to put it in perspective how much time you spend trellising-

Trip Shaw (36:34):

These I've had now for at least a few seasons, I'd say, so they give you a decent spool. So, at the end I'm just snipping them and I think cutting the base of the plant. And I think I asked, I was trying to pick your brain the last year or the year before on the best system of removing them.

Andy Chamberlin (36:54):

On the strings?

Trip Shaw (36:55):

Just getting the tomatoes out, cleaning the tunnels at the end. I think if I had biodegradable clips, I think you better start walking in case it ... Then I could just take the whole everything and either throw it in a compost pile or burn it, I guess. But taking all the clips off at the end is pretty tedious.

Andy Chamberlin (37:18):

Yeah, not the most fun.

Trip Shaw (37:20):

Or I've let the plant stay in there so long where you can just smack your hands and they get so dried up that they turn into almost nothing.

Andy Chamberlin (37:28):

Or they get really nasty.

Trip Shaw (37:30):

Or yeah, if you get them in between and they're re-hydrated.

Andy Chamberlin (37:33):

When they get frosted so they're dead but they're just slimy and gross, yeah.

Trip Shaw (37:37):

Yeah. For a good while it was just kind of, I don't know, or still it provides a full-time job basically for me. In the beginning though I was still doing, I mean, I still work for a couple of [inaudible 00:37:59] departments, but it's more of, I don't know, a job for me and now I'm trying to think of it as maybe more of a farm or something. I don't know.

Andy Chamberlin (38:10):

Yeah, a career?

Trip Shaw (38:11):

Yeah, I guess, yeah. Yeah, I don't know. I worked on a friend's vegetable farm in high school and I just thought it was okay. I don't know.

Andy Chamberlin (38:25):

So, how long have you been doing this?

Trip Shaw (38:28):

This is the 16th summer.

Andy Chamberlin (38:30):

Did you go to school for anything?

Trip Shaw (38:34):

Actually I went to school for finance and got a minor in computer science.

Andy Chamberlin (38:37):

Oh well, finance is a good thing to ...

Trip Shaw (38:39):

Yeah. I went to UVM.

Andy Chamberlin (38:41):

Oh.

Trip Shaw (38:41):

I graduated in 2009 so it was like, I guess the financial crisis or something.

Andy Chamberlin (38:49):

Yeah.

Trip Shaw (38:49):

And then, my cousin was like, "Hey, why don't you take advantage of the land?"

Andy Chamberlin (38:58):

Yeah. So, is this family land you live right here?

Trip Shaw (39:02):

Well, yeah. I was growing where the hoop houses are and then across the street where I have an asparagus patch now. And then, I only got this field in 2019 from Cynthia. And so, I guess it's only been since then that I've been learning how to scale up and so yeah, it's still very new to me.

Andy Chamberlin (39:23):

Very new but you've been doing it for 16 years [inaudible 00:39:26] eight acres.

Trip Shaw (39:26):

Yeah.

Andy Chamberlin (39:30):

No, you're humble. I always just put it in perspective sometimes when I'm talking to somebody else. Like this spring, someone asked me, "Are you doing strawberries again?" I said, "Yeah, we're getting into strawberries." I said, "We're just planting a few, just like a thousand plants." And their eyes just opened real wild like, "A thousand plants?" I'm like, "Yeah, it's just four short rows."

Trip Shaw (39:53):

Yeah. Here's last year's strawberries. Yeah Nourse, are you getting them from Nourse?

Andy Chamberlin (40:00):

Yeah.

Trip Shaw (40:01):

Is that why you're getting a thousand now because of their pricing structure changes?

Andy Chamberlin (40:04):

No, no. It's my first time trialing it in black plastic so I didn't want to get into over my head yet so I kind of doing a trial run before we scale up to an acre 'cause our farm used to have two acres of strawberries all pick your own.

Trip Shaw (40:21):

Oh, sweet.

Andy Chamberlin (40:21):

So, I know the community would support it, would accept that again but-

Trip Shaw (40:28):

Oh, that'd be amazing.

Andy Chamberlin (40:28):

So, my four little rows are going to sell out real fast, but it's before we always did matted row and-

Trip Shaw (40:35):

I mean a thousand plants, if they yield good you'd be surprised you get a lot.

Andy Chamberlin (40:40):

That's potentially a lot of fruits.

Trip Shaw (40:41):

This is a thousand plants here.

Andy Chamberlin (40:43):

Is it?

Trip Shaw (40:43):

Yeah, the deer is my biggest problem, they seem to come and get a lot of the runners when they're starting or get a lot of the new growth but ...

Andy Chamberlin (40:51):

Okay.

Trip Shaw (40:52):

And that's called-

Andy Chamberlin (40:53):

This single row?

Trip Shaw (40:54):

What's that?

Andy Chamberlin (40:54):

This single row?

Trip Shaw (40:55):

Yep. Matted, whatever. Yeah, the plants go a lot further with the matted row system I guess. But yeah, Nourse, they changed it where it's cheaper to get 500 than it is to get like 100 or something so yeah so this is just two varieties.

Andy Chamberlin (41:14):

Is this bio plastic?

Trip Shaw (41:16):

Yep.

Andy Chamberlin (41:17):

Okay. So, you single row, were these plugs or ...

Trip Shaw (41:22):

Bare roots.

Andy Chamberlin (41:22):

Bare roots?

Trip Shaw (41:23):

Oh, yeah. Are you doing bare roots?

Andy Chamberlin (41:25):

Yeah, we're doing bare roots and bio plastic and I'm hoping to mulch with straw.

Trip Shaw (41:30):

Get that tool. You know what I'm talking about?

Andy Chamberlin (41:32):

Yeah.

Trip Shaw (41:32):

Okay. Yeah.

Andy Chamberlin (41:34):

I was kind of wondering, I needed to make a set of tool or buy or something.

Trip Shaw (41:39):

Yeah, I told my friend I bought it he's like, "Oh dude, you're an idiot." He's like, "Why'd you buy that?" I was like, "Dude, it's got this sweet curve."

Andy Chamberlin (41:48):

Just a piece of metal with a cut in it, yeah.

Trip Shaw (41:53):

No, it made planting a breeze and you're minimizing your opening in the plastic for-

Andy Chamberlin (41:59):

Rye.

Trip Shaw (41:59):

Weeds. But yeah, I ended up borrowing a friend's mower and mowing brush hogging the weeds. These are old lambs quarter.

Andy Chamberlin (42:09):

Oh, yeah.

Trip Shaw (42:12):

So, you're going to mulch the footpaths basically once you plant it out or you're going to cultivate them first and then ...

Andy Chamberlin (42:22):

Yeah, I'm going to mulch I think in between or do plastic during, probably do plastic this summer, the weed mat row fabric.

Trip Shaw (42:31):

Okay.

Andy Chamberlin (42:32):

Then I'll pull that up in the fall, but then cover them with straw for winter.

Trip Shaw (42:37):

Nice.

Andy Chamberlin (42:38):

And then, they'll be nice and mulched again for picking next spring.

Trip Shaw (42:43):

Yeah, at fall I'll like to see how that works. I had dreams of doing the pick your own strawberry here.

Andy Chamberlin (42:49):

Well, yeah, you've got a great site for that.

Trip Shaw (42:52):

Yeah.

Andy Chamberlin (42:53):

Accessible fields, even your fields that are further away. It's an easy walk because it's flat, nicely sloped so like good drainage.

Trip Shaw (43:00):

But this wouldn't fly for pick your own.

Andy Chamberlin (43:04):

Yeah, you got to keep a clean patch for pick your own, which is a trick.

Trip Shaw (43:08):

But I think that would be just nice to provide that for, I don't know, to give back I guess in a way. And obviously most of the labor is picking so if they're picking them and paying you to pick your, it's like, huh.

Andy Chamberlin (43:27):

Exactly. Yep.

Trip Shaw (43:28):

But yeah, we want to do, once the kitchen is up and going, we have ambitions to do some kind of like asparagus festival or something or whatever crops doing real good and just try to cook up a bunch of it and just have it for free to the farm stand customers because a lot of these people have been coming now for the whole time I've been doing it and they're kind of, I don't know, got to give back somehow.

Andy Chamberlin (43:55):

Yeah.

Trip Shaw (43:57):

This patch here, I'm thinking carrots and beets and stuff. A lot of stuff is like all my lettuce is kind of here is based on the deer. I don't know if you have, do you have a fence or you get deer problem?

Andy Chamberlin (44:11):

No, we have deer sometimes, yeah.

Trip Shaw (44:14):

And so yeah, a lot of it's if I feel like if I keep it closer to kind of stuff and then stuff that the deer won't bother like the potatoes or whatever or garlic can be or onions could be out there, but I don't know. We put in for a grant for a fence so I had to an estimate and the fence would cost more than this field. Yeah. Ouch.

Andy Chamberlin (44:39):

Yeah, those who have perimeter fence usually got a good grant to do so from what I hear.

Trip Shaw (44:45):

Yeah, I may start thinking about it in sections because even the grants that we could apply for have the 20% matching and 20% of what a fence would be is-

Andy Chamberlin (44:57):

Still a lot.

Trip Shaw (44:58):

Yeah. Yeah, we just got the Climate-Smart grant. Yeah, hopefully not like, my friends in New York state they get all jealous because I guess New York doesn't have as much of a grant program, but we got the CSAP grant for an outdoor CoolBot cooler here.

Andy Chamberlin (45:16):

Oh, nice.

Trip Shaw (45:19):

Yeah, last year I had to bring, that one was filled with potatoes first, had the potatoes just in there and made a dark room and I had to bring all my carrots to a friend's cooler so I figured that'd be, hopefully you can't go wrong with more space.

Andy Chamberlin (45:36):

Yeah.

Trip Shaw (45:37):

But yeah, we got to prep for the pad, get that poured and supposedly have it all done by, I think the 1st of June or end of June.

Andy Chamberlin (45:48):

And all the planting done by early June.

Trip Shaw (45:50):

Yeah.

Andy Chamberlin (45:52):

What does sustainable farming mean to you and what are you doing to achieve it?

Trip Shaw (45:59):

I guess just being able to keep doing this every year, year after year. Making small improvements and I don't know. Yeah, I don't know.

Andy Chamberlin (46:15):

What are you most excited about coming into this season?

Trip Shaw (46:21):

Good food. Yeah. Hopefully eating some of the good food with my family.

Andy Chamberlin (46:29):

Yeah, that's good. You've done it enough, you've got your infrastructure and now-

Trip Shaw (46:33):

Kind of, well, not really. I still ... I was asking, people probably hate me on Instagram 'cause I'm asking them questions, MorningStar Farm, I was asking him some potato questions or my friend Chris, he was helping me. I was like, "Oh, I hope I can do this for long enough or get old enough where it's like I don't get anxious or whatever or care." Just like I don't ...

Andy Chamberlin (46:59):

It's hard.

Trip Shaw (47:00):

I always get all kind of worked up in the beginning.

Andy Chamberlin (47:03):

Yeah.

Trip Shaw (47:03):

Very anxious. A lot of the anxiety comes from working with old machines and trying to keep those going.

Andy Chamberlin (47:11):

Right. And especially because you have two 140s but they're each kind of set up to do their own thing.

Trip Shaw (47:18):

Yeah.

Andy Chamberlin (47:19):

You don't necessarily have the redundancy if one goes down.

Trip Shaw (47:24):

Initially it was more for the redundancy 'cause I just realized I was like, "Man, this thing does everything. If this thing fails me, I'm in trouble." Even when I was getting them, they were 20, that one was maybe 2100.

Andy Chamberlin (47:35):

Yeah, nice.

Trip Shaw (47:36):

So, it's almost cheaper than a rototiller.

Andy Chamberlin (47:40):

Yeah. You have more in the Tilmor tools than the tractors-

Trip Shaw (47:43):

Oh, definitely. Yeah.

Andy Chamberlin (47:45):

What fulfills you in this career?

Trip Shaw (47:48):

Well, allows me to stay in town, otherwise, you'd have to drive for 30 minutes for work. I guess working outdoors, growing our own food so we know where it comes from.

Andy Chamberlin (48:06):

And do you have any long-term plans for the farm? You think it'll change a whole lot in the next 10 years?

Trip Shaw (48:15):

We like to do some pick your own stuff and more stuff to draw families to the farm so they can have an experience. Provide I guess farm experience to, I don't know. It kind of grew on me. Like I said, I was working on other things meanwhile and then it just kind eventually it was like, "All right, maybe I can just keep doing this." And I didn't put much into it initially, this is kind of like the field in 2019 was the first kind of money I put into it. And then, that's finally paid for and now took on some more debt for this. But the grant that started this was because it's the APR field so they had a farm viability grant.

Andy Chamberlin (49:02):

Okay.

Trip Shaw (49:03):

And first I was thinking about just doing a three-bay maximizing the money they gave us to build a three-bay shed for my tractors. But then my wife was like, "Oh, why don't we build a barn and oh wait, maybe we should have a farm stand in there and oh, let's have a kitchen and a wash pack in." And even though I've been doing it a while it all still, it seems pretty new.

Andy Chamberlin (49:29):

Yeah.

Trip Shaw (49:29):

I mean, getting that poly planter junior, getting plastic, that's only in the last couple of years so now this is the new building.

Andy Chamberlin (49:39):

A lot of new things to keep testing out.

Trip Shaw (49:41):

It's tough though at the same time, I don't know, I draw on it more in the winter. But not having a boss or working for yourself because people think, "Oh, that's got to be the best," but ...

Andy Chamberlin (49:54):

It's harder than people realize.

Trip Shaw (49:55):

Yeah.

Andy Chamberlin (49:56):

What do you do outside of farming for fun?

Trip Shaw (50:01):

Metal detecting I've gotten into.

Andy Chamberlin (50:02):

Oh, neat.

Trip Shaw (50:03):

Over the last maybe three or four years. I was sowing garlic over there and I found an Indian Head cent, so then it kind of sparked me. I borrowed a friend's detector and then borrowed another friend's and then bought one and man, right. You wouldn't believe the stuff that's in this field. The last two, I haven't been since two Januaries ago, just because I get consumed by work like this doing this.

Andy Chamberlin (50:33):

Right.

Trip Shaw (50:34):

But right over there I found a three-cent. Have you heard of them? The trime it's called?

Andy Chamberlin (50:39):

No.

Trip Shaw (50:40):

It's the smallest silver that the US government I think meant that it's a three-cent silver piece. They only made it from 1850 something to early '50s. So, the one I found was a 1853. Over there I found a 180, you know what large cents are?

Andy Chamberlin (51:06):

I think so.

Trip Shaw (51:06):

Just like they're huge pennies. It's the 18 something penny.

Andy Chamberlin (51:08):

That's cool.

Trip Shaw (51:09):

Down there I found there's a cuff link off of a Continental Revolutionary War soldier.

Andy Chamberlin (51:17):

Yeah, you got some old stuff in this field.

Trip Shaw (51:19):

Yeah, a lot of old buttons. I think there's been a lot of activity around here and I think they used to have, the house there is built in 1780 but I think they also had kind of smaller houses or cabins kind of where-

Andy Chamberlin (51:35):

That would make sense.

Trip Shaw (51:35):

People would live and work in the fields. Yeah, so metal detecting, swimming I guess in the river down the road.

Andy Chamberlin (51:43):

Nice.

Trip Shaw (51:44):

Maybe I'm kind of boring.

Andy Chamberlin (51:47):

No, it's simple. That's fine.

Trip Shaw (51:50):

When I started I was complaining to my friend yesterday, I had pretty much go to the river at least a couple of times a week. And well, I was like 22, so I felt way less responsible. And now, even though I'm my own boss I don't like to go swimming because I tell myself, "I don't have time, I got to get all this stuff planted." Sometimes-

Andy Chamberlin (52:13):

You're an adult now you're responsible, business and kids.

Trip Shaw (52:18):

Yeah. But yeah, I don't know.

Andy Chamberlin (52:21):

It's good to cool down now.

Trip Shaw (52:22):

The building makes it seem more serious than it is. Before the building it was kind of just, I'd pop stuff up in the old horse barn and now it seems all official and it should be more than I am or something.

Andy Chamberlin (52:36):

It might become more than what you'd imagine.

Trip Shaw (52:41):

Yeah. I had a dirt bike but that was sitting around so I sold that, bought the Perfecta. Yeah.

Andy Chamberlin (52:50):

Bummer.

Trip Shaw (52:52):

Yeah. I actually got more for, I had a dual sport, I sold to the guy in Vermont. I got more, I think more than I paid for it.

Andy Chamberlin (52:59):

Nice.

Trip Shaw (53:00):

Off Craigslist and yeah, I don't know.

Andy Chamberlin (53:03):

If you were to restart farming now knowing all the knowledge you've acquired in the last 15 years, is there anything that you would do differently or what do you think you would invest in first?

Trip Shaw (53:18):

I kind of feel like I had to make the mistakes I made along the way I guess and learn with the pieces of equipment I had maybe. It'd be nice to say, "Oh yeah, I'd buy all the sweetest stuff right away," but I don't know if I did the first year if I'd be ready to operate all that or whatnot.

Andy Chamberlin (53:38):

That is a wise answer.

Trip Shaw (53:41):

You know what I mean though? You think, but I don't know.

Andy Chamberlin (53:46):

Yeah, in order to grow you have to fail a certain number of times in order to either appreciate or understand and know what tools you need.

Trip Shaw (53:57):

Yeah. So yeah, I don't know what I would do sooner. I don't know. The thing is that I didn't think it grew on me, I didn't ...

Andy Chamberlin (54:10):

Yeah.

Trip Shaw (54:10):

I didn't think I was going to kind of still be at it. Yeah.

Andy Chamberlin (54:15):

That's okay too.

(54:23):

And that was The Farmer's Share. I hope you enjoyed this episode with Trip Shaw of Four Corners Farm. The Farmer's Share is supported by a grant offered by the USDA Specialty Crop Block Program from the Vermont Agency of Agriculture, Food and Markets. This funding helps to cover some of my time and travel in order to produce this podcast until March of 2026. The USDA Agricultural Marketing Service supports projects that address the needs of US specialty crop growers and strengthens local and regional food systems. I have no doubt that this podcast will meet those needs and help educate growers to support the industry. If you enjoy the show and want to help support its programming, you can make a one-time or reoccurring donation on our website by visiting thefarmersshare.com/support.

(55:12):

The show is also supported by the Ag Engineering Program of the University of Vermont Extension. We also receive funding from the Vermont Vegetable and Berry Growers Association. The VVBGA is a nonprofit organization funded in 1976 to promote the economic, environmental and social sustainability of vegetable and berry farming in Vermont. Their membership includes over 400 farms across Vermont and beyond, as well as about 50 businesses and organizations that provide products and services of all types to their members. Benefits to members include access to the VVBGA listserv to buy, sell plants and equipment, share farming information and tap the vast experience of our growers. Access the Community Accreditation for Produce Safety also known as CAPS. This program is designed for growers by growers to help you easily meet market and regulatory food safety expectations.

(56:11):

You can access the VVBGA's Soil Health platform where you can organize all the soil tests and create and store your soil amendment plans and records. Access to webinars for growers in VVBGA annual meeting, an email subscription to the Vermont Vegetable and Berry Newsletter, camaraderie, enhanced communication and fellowship among commercial growers. Memberships are on a per-farm per-calendar year basis and annual dues this year are $80. These funds pay for the organization's operating costs and support educational programs and research projects. These funds also support projects that address grower needs around ag engineering, high tunnel production, pest management, pollinators, produce safety and soil health. Become a member today to be a part of and further support the veg and berry industry.

(57:05):

You can visit thefarmersshare.com to listen to previous interviews or see photos, videos or links discussed from the conversation. If you don't want to miss the next episode, enter your email address on our website and you'll get a note in your inbox when the next one comes out. The Farmer's Share has a YouTube channel with videos from several of the farm visits. We're also on Instagram and that's where you can be reminded about the latest episode or see photos from the visit. Lastly, if you're enjoying the show, I'd love it if you could write a review. In Apple Podcast just click on the show, scroll down to the bottom and there you can leave five stars in a comment to help encourage new listeners to tune in. I'd also encourage you to share this episode with other grower friends or crew who you think would be inspiring for them. Thanks for listening.